quake/periodic/agqr_faq
From: kapi@gamers.org
Newsgroups: alt.games.quake,rec.games.computer.quake.misc
Subject: FAQ: replacement of a.g.q by rec.games.computer.quake.*
Organization: none
Approved: kapi@gamers.org
Followup-To: poster
Keywords: Quake newsgroups replacement
FAQ: replacement of a.g.q by rec.games.computer.quake.*
=======================================================
Last edited on: $Date: 1997/02/18 01:19:21 $
Revision: $Revision: 1.14 $
1) What is this FAQ?
--------------------
This is a list of answers to some questions that have been posted
several times in the Quake newsgroups about the purpose of these
groups. This is not a FAQ about the game itself. If you want some
info about Quake, you should read the Quake Mini-FAQ which is posted
weekly in rec.games.computer.quake.announce.
Many people have posted questions about the move from
alt.games.quake to the rec.games.computer.quake.* hierarchy.
Although the answers to these questions have been posted several
times, they had never been summarised and they were often
misunderstood. This FAQ will hopefully provide these answers in a
clear and consise way and will help you to get a better
understanding of the situation.
I will accept any additions or corrections to the answers provided in
this FAQ. Comments from those who support or are opposed to the move
to the new groups are equally welcome. They will be added to this FAQ
as long as they provide accurate and helpful answers. Send your
suggestions to me at
Several Quake players and news administrators have provided answers
and suggestions for this FAQ. Most of the answers have been written
by Raphael Quinet, so blame him if you think that some of them are
wrong. :-) If you contribute to this FAQ, you can choose to have
your name added to this hall of flame.
2) Why did the Quake groups move to rec.games.computer.quake.*?
---------------------------------------------------------------
- Propagation. Since there are no formal rules for creating and
removing groups in the alt.* hierarchy, some sites only carry a
limited set of alt.* groups, or do not carry any of them because of
the additional workload they put on the administrator. On the other
hand, most sites carry groups in the rec.* hierarchy. In 1995, the
readers of a.g.q chose to move to the rec.* hierarchy in order to
reach a wider audience and make sure that nobody is deprived from the
information about Quake.
- Better structure. Six groups are available in the r.g.c.q.*
hierarchy (.announce, .editing, .misc, .playing, .quake-c,
.servers), each with its own set of topics, so that readers can
easily choose the articles in which they are interested.
- Presence of a moderated r.g.c.q.announce group. This is very useful
for those who don't have the time to browse the discussion groups or
who pay for their newsfeed and only want to read the important
announcements in a low-traffic group. Also, the articles are checked
by the moderator before they are posted, so the information is more
accurate.
- Room for expansion. Three groups (.announce, .editing, .misc) were
created at first, in January 1996. When the traffic increased, two
additional groups (.playing, .servers) were added in May. The
latest addition is the .quake-c group, which was created in October.
All these groups have a good propagation, which would not have been
possible if thay had been created as sub-groups of alt.games.quake,
because it is now very difficult to create a group in the alt.*
hierarchy with a good propagation. This is a consequence of the
expansion of the Internet in the last year(s) and the increased
number of people trying to abuse the freedom of creating alt.*
groups by creating "joke" groups, thus causing some admins to ignore
all future requests for groups.
3) Why was it necessary to replace a.g.q by r.g.c.q.misc instead of
simply adding the new groups and keeping the old one?
-------------------------------------------------------------------
- Avoiding the duplication of resources. Keeping groups in two
hierarchies would lead to a large number of cross-postings or
information posted twice. This is a waste of resources and of
reader's time. Besides, cross-posts between a single group and a
hierarchy of several groups (each with its own charter) would increase
the number of articles that are posted in the wrong part of the new
hierarchy and thus reduce the benefits of having a well-structured
set of groups.
- Helping the newcomers. It is unfortunately easier to find the old
group than the new ones, because the groups are sorted in alphabetical
order and r.g.c.q.* is located further down in the list of groups and
deeper in the hierarchy (five levels instead of three). Keeping the
old group would imply that some newcomers would not find the new ones
easily and would be lost for several days or weeks in a.g.q before
they can find the FAQ and other useful documents in r.g.c.q.*, as well
as getting help from more experienced readers.
- Ensuring that everybody can get the information about Quake. Since
a.g.q had a spotty propagation (this was already the case before it
was replaced by r.g.c.q.misc), people who only read that group do not
get all articles and would miss some information. Also, because many
people can get the r.g.c.q.* groups and cannot get a.g.q, they would
be deprived from the information posted in the old group (unless all
articles are cross-posted, but then we are back to the duplication of
resources).
4) Who decided what, and when?
------------------------------
- The creation of new groups for Quake was discussed in
alt.games.quake in August 1995. A mailing list (quake-proposal) was
created for this purpose and after a few weeks (on the 19th of
September), a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) was posted to all
related groups. On the 20th of October, this was followed by a Call
For Votes (CFV), asking the readers of alt.games.quake to vote for or
against the move to the new groups. The results were published on the
10th of November and showed that a large majority of readers (199:43)
voted for the new groups. The full text of the RFD, CFV and results
of the Usenet vote are available on ftp.uu.net, at the following URL:
ftp://ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announce.newgroups/rec/rec.games.computer.quake
The three groups were officially created on the 8th of January by
David C. Lawrence, the moderator of news.announce.newgroups.
- The replacement of a.g.q was part of the RFD for the new groups.
The RFDs for rec.* groups have no direct power over the alt.*
hierarchy, for which the creation and removal of groups should be
discussed in alt.config. But the results of the vote give useful
indications (like an opinion poll would) and are usually appreciated
by the Usenet administrators who read alt.config. On the 31st of
January, a double proposal was posted, including the creation of
alt.games.upcoming-3d and the removal of alt.games.quake. This
proposal was discussed both in alt.games.quake and alt.config. Two
weeks later, a control message was sent, suggesting to alias a.g.q
to r.g.c.q.misc, so that all messages would be directed to the new
group automatically. As is always the case with alt.* groups, the
decision of removing, aliasing or keeping the old group at each site
was left up to the administrator of that site.
- The way Usenet works, regarding the creation or removal of groups,
is often confusing. Several articles try to describe it and you
should read them if you want more information about this. Take a look
in news.announce.newusers and news.answers, and read the following
articles: "What is Usenet?", "What is Usenet? A second opinion.",
"How to Create a New Usenet Newsgroup", "Guidelines on Usenet
Newsgroup Names". Read them in that order if possible. They will
give you more information and explain things better than this FAQ.
Once you have read these articles, you should also take a look at:
http://www.tezcat.com/~haz1/alt/faqindex.html
5) I didn't know all that. How was I supposed to know?
-------------------------------------------------------
If you never saw an article discussing the move to the r.g.c.q.*
groups or announcing the replacement of a.g.q by r.g.c.q.misc, you
probably didn't read a.g.q between August 1995 and March 1996. Or
maybe you subscribed to the Quake groups after the release of the
test version of Quake and you are wondering what is happening to the
newsgroups (maybe you were lost in the noise that followed the
release). During the RFD and CFV period in 1995, a lot of articles
were posted in a.g.q about the creation of the new groups.
During January and February 1996, several threads of discussion were
cross-posted in a.g.q and r.g.c.q.misc, proposing and then
announcing the replacement of the old group by r.g.c.q.misc. These
articles have certainly expired on your server, but you can use the
old database of DejaNews and do a search on the following subjects:
"PROPOSALS: alt.games.upcoming-3d, removal of alt.games.quake",
"NOTICE: removal of alt.games.quake", "Please move to
rec.games.computer.quake.misc or alt.games.upcoming-3d". The move
to the new groups was also announced several times in the Quake
Mini-FAQ and in the "alt.games.quake FAQ", in order to make sure
that all readers were aware of this.
Between the 1st of February and the 11th of March 1996, a total of 274
articles about the move to r.g.c.q.* were posted in various groups and
218 of them were posted or cross-posted in alt.games.quake (not
counting the periodical postings of the FAQs).
6) Why do I still see alt.games.quake at my site?
-------------------------------------------------
Some sites ignore all rmgroup control messages for alt.* groups and
only remove a group if it had no traffic for three months or more.
On these servers, the only way to make sure that alt.games.quake is
removed or aliased to rec.games.computer.quake.misc is to e-mail the
news administrator (usually by sending a message to the address
"news", "newsmaster" or "usenet" at your site) or wait until no more
messages are posted in this group... which will probably never
happen because of the amount of spam cross-posted all over Usenet.
7) Can I do something about this? How can I help?
--------------------------------------------------
- If your site is still carrying alt.games.quake, you should get in
touch with your news administrator and ask him/her to alias it to
rec.games.computer.quake.misc, preparatory to removing it when the
traffic dies down. The address of your news administrator should be
something like "news", "newsmaster" or "usenet".
- Stop posting in alt.games.quake and post only in the new r.g.c.q.*
groups. By posting in a.g.q, you are increasing the traffic and
making it more difficult to remove the group. The traffic is
decreasing, but very slowly. If you stop posting there, the traffic
will drop down quickly and it will be easier for you and others to
convince your news administrators that a.g.q should be replaced. If
you are replying to an article which is cross-posted, make sure that
you remove alt.games.quake from the list of followups.
8) What other related groups exist?
-----------------------------------
- alt.games.upcoming-3d, for those who liked the atmosphere of the old
alt.games.quake, with the rumours and speculation about Quake. Since
the release of the test version of Quake, this kind of discussion is
less frequent. However, other 3D games are under development or in
project, and it can be fun to compare them or speculate about them in
alt.games.upcoming-3d.
- alt.binaries.games.quake, for posting files which are related to
Quake (new levels, patches, editors, etc.). This is not a discussion
group, so you should only post binaries there. Discussion should take
place in the other groups (use r.g.c.q.misc or r.g.c.q.editing, as
appropriate).
... and remember: Quake is a game. Just a game ...
-------------------- End of FAQ --------------------